Good bye Demotix

Patricio,

I want to jump into this personally.

Obviously, I'm sad you're leaving, I hope it's 'au revoir' and not 'adieu', and I hope I can go some way towards explaining SOME of your frustrations here. I also want to thank you for making the effort of setting all this out in writing. You do the community, our team and me a real favour.

So:
1. SALES
a) Pictures for Pennies:
We have two (and only two) low-price deals in place.
They are with 2 fantastic charities: Global Voices, and OpenDemocracy.
Check them out: they are groundbreaking, and they cover breaking news and op-ed perspectives nobody else touches. They're not-for-profit organisations run by a volunteer network, and they are exactly the kind of news organisation that I believe Demotix should be supporting.

b) Low Sales Volume:
From September to October, our sales grew 9%
From Oct 2010 to Oct 2011, our sales are up 480%
Annualised, we are generating a little under $500,000 USD.
And on a monthly basis, we are paying hundreds of contributors from all over the world, an average of $60-70.
You were with us at the beginning, when things we're really tough. Today, that's no longer the case. And over the next 6 months, that’s going to explode. Now is when the fun really starts.

2. COMMUNICATION
a) Contributor feedback
Our comms to contributors have been - it turns out - disastrous over the last few months.
We had a massive technical screwup recently which has meant that none of the emails sent through the contact form got through. Tom - who was brought on this summer specifically to deal with our comms to contributors - has been getting back to a lot of the people who've been waiting for a response this week. Anyone who's frustrated with long waits for other staff to reply should drop him an email (tom@demotix.com) - his job is to be your representative and make sure that your voice is heard by the rest of the team.

b) Sales notifications
They suck. And there's almost nothing we can do about it, because the blockage is almost entirely with our clients.
Demotix is trying to do something almost nobody does in the breaking news space: get our clients to tell us exactly which photos they used and when. This is a big shift from the all-you-can-eat culture they're used to from other agencies. Every time we take on a new client, we have to explain to them and their tech people how this can be done. They don't always get it right straight away, and they certainly don’t do it in a timely way. That’s where you guys get frustrated, but trust me – that frustration is more than echoed here.

3. GLOBAL-LOCAL NEWS
a) Editorial help with news events.
Demotix is about to launch a free news alert system covering the globe, which will be automated, daily/weekly, and locally relevant. We've been playing with the tech and the service for a couple of months now, and it's almost ready.
b) Local Sales:
We do a bad job in Latin America. We have local resellers in every market there (LatinStock), and their sales for us are improving, but they are MILES from where they should be. A big part of the problem is the absence of Spanish across Demotix. We're looking - right now - for new partners in Latin and Central America (and Spain).

4. CORBIS
Corbis sales of Demotix content have been increasing by c. 30% every month. That's huge. It's from a low base, and I keep shouting and jumping and telling them to do better. But while they're slow - big companies turn like supertankers - they're about to launch a media desk that should really help them accelerate into the news market. On the archive side, we already know how powerful Corbis are.
Watch this space.

5. MODERATED COMMENTS
The comment moderation is no reflection on your freedom to say what you want in the forum!
We've got a hyperactive spam filter that we can't disable because we'll all be drowned in rubbish!
We're changing this, but our tech team isn't huge and it's slipped down our list.

This is a time of extraordinary growth for us. I know we have failed to keep on top of everything – from comms, to sales, to tech – but we have really tried, and we really keep on trying.

Demotix is structured to ensure that we and you are facing the same direction. We can only grow if you are happy; we can only stay alive if you are making money. We continue to abide by that absolute principle.

Keep an eye out, please, for our progress over the coming months.
And I hope to see you back with us.

Un abrazo
Turi

One thing I love about Demotix is your honesty.
I cannot recommend you all high enough, contributing to Demotix has enabled me to have 10 pictures published and has helped me to (I hope) improve my photography, which I love. Also gives us the chance to communicate with other photogs around the globe encouraging each other.
I guess the harsh reality that we as CJs have to face is that if u want to get on the front page of The Times etc is that u r competing with many pros, so u need to always look for the 'angle' and have a blinking good photo uploaded asap.
Keep up the great work
Barnie Rabbit

Hi Turi,
First, thnks for taking the time to answer personally, and I would want to clarify something: I'm not implying Demotix isn't working. I'm saying it's not working for me.

I'll only adress the Sales issue to make my point clear, the other issues may hopefully get a debate started...

I've been part of Demotix for nearly three years, yet I've made some usd50 out of over a thousand pictures uploaded. So, it's clear, as I said: for me it's not working.
Then again, this is not Demotix fault. This has to do with the relevance (or better the lack of it) of the place of the world I happen to live, which is, let's face it, zero. So, in terms of sales, unless something odd happens in the developed world that they start looking down here, say there's a revolution or magnicide or natural catastrophe, or we start to shoot pictures of international celebrities visiting Buenos Aires or football, we're screwed, it isn't worth the effort involved in uploading, writing the story, captioning. I'm sure for photographers covering the Greek riots or the Arab Spring the story is completely different.

Now, about Global Voices and such deals, I may be alone on this one, but I agree, those kind of services should be supported, and I'd rather give a picture or two every now and then for free rather than getting some pennies, so something like "by uploading to Demotix you accept that, ocassionally, some of your pictures may be used by non profit NGOs giving you full credit" would do, I would happily sign it.

Now, about the Moderated comments
The moment I sent the message (which, by the way, didn't get the "awaiting moderation" message I got on the other!) I knew that it implied some kind of censorship and it isn't fair at all. So, I apologize.

Best,
Pat

Would like to reply here also...

I´ve been member for of Demotix for maybe 3 months, and have about 500 pictures uploaded on the site.

There are very important topics in Patricio´s post, and several of them have been in my mind many times, communication, the log of sales and the price for pictures to Global voices.

The one thing that bugs me most about the whole system about sales are the time it takes to get payment and log of sold pictures, but this is a BIG problem with other agencies also. Another agency i work for sold pictures for me in April, and I´ve still not seen in in any sales report about it. I recently got a sales report from the same agency, and pictures sold as long back as January gets paid now, that´s just f..... up, sorry my expression. It´s incredible that with the technology we have now that this takes so much time. It must be a way to get an instant confirmation when your picture is sold. Not only for the trust, but its also a big kick in the a.. to go out and shot more and upload more. The system must be improved! I think this is the most important issue for me...

For me, Demotix is far from perfect, but because of the speed to get your pictures out, and because they have sold some of my pictures I will continue uploading.

Thx to Patricio for posting a important post, it really got my attention!

Best regards from Alexander in Thailand.

I'm going to stick up for Demotix and what they are trying to do
1. By promoting citizen journalism Demotix has, it seems to me, bought itself a whole pack of resistance from the vested interests of the Press. The Press with few exceptions is in a lamentable condition here in the UK being more pre-occupied with celebrity culture, and all kinds of x-factor trivia. You probably make money from paparazzi work here in the UK by stuffing your camera into the face of some z-list celebrity looser for the gutter press but if you're serious about learning photojournalism 'on the job' demotix is the only place on the web I have found where us well meaning amateurs have got what it takes. To date I aint sold a bean but thoroughly enjoyed the learning experience and considering some of the old tat i've put up the wire I'm surprised they're even still talking to me.

2. I live in a small market town in the south west of England. If it's hot news you want, dont come to Wareham, where this leaves me now I'm no sure. I've been on the dole for nearly 2 years now and am stone broke. If my camera blows up I'm finished anyhow. So am I going to go on. Yes for as long as I can. I have the Demotix press pass and the accreditation letters to draw on now and hope they can help but whats most important is that the sheer support that Demotix have given me has enabled me to secure a £300 bursary to attend an NCTJ accredited photojournalism course something I otherwise wouldn't have been able to do.

3. Demotix has made a brave attempt to open up journalism to people actually on the ground who otherwise wouldn't have stood a chance of breaking the stranglehold that Wapping and Fleet St and the Big corporate groups that own local papers run and even if I dont make the grade (and blow the last of my savings along with this bursary to make something of my otherwise mispent life) I've been grateful for the chance to have ago and for that Turi and all at Demotix thank you.

4. I aint sold a bean, not a red cent, who's interested in parish bunfights, small town carnivals and all the other boring stuff that goes on in an area where nothing ever happens but nevertheless its been great to get out and about with the camera rather than getting stuck at home and getting bored stiff and I'm assuming that the staff at Demotix have shown it to someone even if it is garbage.

So Demotix for the sheer lift you have given me in my spirits and the joy of what I've been doing thanks. I'll stick with you. You're the only ones I could find would give me a chance.

God bless

Turi , don't spin yarn , please.

You said: "1. SALES
a) Pictures for Pennies:
We have two (and only two) low-price deals in place.
They are with 2 fantastic charities: Global Voices, and OpenDemocracy.
Check them out: they are groundbreaking, and they cover breaking news and op-ed perspectives nobody else touches. They're not-for-profit organisations run by a volunteer network, and they are exactly the kind of news organisation that I believe Demotix should be supporting. "

Well - few of my "Pictures for Pennies":

Tue, 08/11/2011 - 01:09 Usage of 739984 (National performs live during Heineken Open'er Festival) by CORBIS (Future Publishing Ltd (music divisi) £1.76
Tue, 08/11/2011 - 01:02 Usage of 736070 (Navy Vessels Parade in Gdynia) by PA Photos Limited (Motor Boats Monthly) £2.85
Tue, 08/11/2011 - 00:53 Usage of 426170 (Donald Tusk on a new school year inauguration - Poland) by Office (Polskieradio) £2.38
Tue, 08/11/2011 - 00:53 Usage of 426164 (Donald Tusk on a new school year inauguration - Poland) by Office (Polskieradio) £2.38

Well I don't see here Global Voices, and OpenDemocracy.

So this is not thru that Yo have only two low-price deals in place.

Michal Fludra

@Michal

Thanks for your note, but I'm not sure what we can do here.
We - Demotix - certainly do only have two low-cost deals in place. Please don't suggest otherwise.

Corbis, PA Photos and Office are resellers of ours.
THEY set the prices of the pictures within their own markets. And we chose them as resellers of quality who strive for the highest prices.
Corbis is the second largest image licensor in the world with a reputation for high quality, high prices. And the Press Association is the UK's national newswire.

Thank you
Turi

Hi everyone,

missed this discussion. Pity Patricio is leaving Demotix, although I understand some of his frustration. And with over 17000 photos and over 600 stories I have had my share of frustration.

But I realised early after joining Demotix, that photojournalism is not a get rich quick activity, and that there is so much Demotix can do; they certainly do more than what I can do with a limited time. My advice is don't give up your day job, and load more images.

It is only recently that I had two successive months when Demotix sent me money. And many of those sales (done recently) were of images taken months if not years ago!

As for the penny payments my attitude is keep those pennies rolling: Sales please take note.

And yes the spam bot s.-u.c.k.s..

have fun

Lawrence

Great to see I've started some kind of debate. I think it's necessary.
I'll answer some of the issues raised, in no particular order.
@ Lawrence:
Quote:
"But I realised early after joining Demotix, that photojournalism is not a get rich quick activity, and that there is so much Demotix can do; they certainly do more than what I can do with a limited time. My advice is don't give up your day job, and load more images."

I think there's a huge leap from expecting to get rich from being a PJ (which I don't think anyone expects) to expect, say, £1.00 from an image use. If the market's shifting towards that model, I'm out, I'd rather post my pictures in forums or in my blog. As of the last part of the quote, I don't have a day job, I earn my living by freelancing both as a photographer and a musician, so to me not getting paid for my job isn't an option. This is my day job, and while I understand that media such as Global Voices and Open Democracy rely on volunteer work and, as I said, I wouldn't mind donating pictures if Demotix feels it's important to back up those organizations, I didn't get paid for this use after more than a year http://www.dr.dk/Nyheder/Udland/2010/07/15/131215.htm?rss=true or this one after almost 7 months: http://www.thejournal.ie/the-week-in-photos-28-127876-Apr2011/#slide-slideshow13.

@Turi
Quote:
"Corbis, PA Photos and Office are resellers of ours.
THEY set the prices of the pictures within their own markets. And we chose them as resellers of quality who strive for the highest prices."

This sounds OK, but it doesn't seem too ilogical to me that Michal may think otherwise since he's actually getting out of this big agencies about the same as Global Voices pays.
Imagine for one second that you get a message that says "Congratulations! You have been published by The BlaBlah Journal!" then you learn that you have to wait some 45 days for them to pay, and then you check your PayPal account and find out that you got £1.50 for that image. You'll sure as hell ask yourself if you got into the microstock business without noticing. That if you ever get paid for that use, as I mentioned in the first paragraph, never got paid from this denmark site (nor have I got any answer about it from Demotix's sales people) or the Journal.
It also doesn't make sense that to me it's actually best in terms of money to be featured in your widget, which is supposed to be used to stream pictures to the media and it's not an actual sale, than actually selling to the media. I mean, I get paid £12,50 if I get into the widget but just one tenth if I actually get published.

To me, just seeing my name printed somewhere isn't enough, and to this moment that's about the only thing I got after three years, pictures here and there with my name on them. I intend to make a living out of this, so it seems logical to me to direct my energy to a more profitable direction.
At least in this part of the world, this model makes sense to someone that, like Lawrence says, has a day job and happens to pass by something newsworthy and has a camera at hand. For someone with a professional interest in photography, it needs some tweaking, it doesn't make any sense to put yourself and your gear at risk to get pictures that in the end will be worth pennies.

Perhaps in the future Demotix evolves into something that's actually useful to people like me, but right now I haven't got a single answer that makes me think I should rethink my decision to stop uploading my work.

Indeed Patricio, a very interesting discussion so thank you for taking the time.

As I said before I quite understand some of your frustrations; and although I mentioned a Day Job I also have some of the issues you mention in my day job.

Trying to interpret your posts it seems to me that maybe the issue is not Demotix, but rather how to make a living with a camera. If "photography" is your day job maybe, and don't think I trying to interfere with your life here, you mind need to do a general rethink about your opportunities.

As I see it, at face value you seem to have three options to make a living with your camera: photojournalism, photography or something else. Excluding the something else, this leaves us with PJ or Photo. Except these two professions are as connected and linked with each as a plane is with a train: they are not connected at all. Photography and PJ are two different creatures.

To cut a long story short, if you want to be a photojournalist, as far as I know, Demotix is your best option. You have an opportunity to develop your style, learn a lot, make contacts, know your way around the profession and most important of all get published. When you approach an editor for a job or as a freelancer they want to know where you've been published and not how much you earned. For example, I can proudly say that I was published in The Guardian - that is all that matters.

Now if you want to work as a photographer, maybe Demotix might not be your first choice, if at all. If you want to work as a photographer you really ought to start thinking about other options for example:

- creating stock that really sells, and we all know that this is perfect images of people doing thing which can be sold for advertising. This means you have to have lighting, maybe access to a studio, pay models, have model releases, have the hardware and software for these images, and belong to the right stock agency.

- or do weddings and other family or people photography. again you need the eqpt, assistants, the contacts, the networking and marketing.

- or pr and business work etc etc

- or let's face it, maybe certain a.d.u.l.t stuff although this is something else altogether.

All these photography options can be very lucrative, if done properly.

I do what I do on Demotix because I am interested in what people are doing, especially if they are passionate about it or doing it professionally, and because I think that photography is the best way of recording what people are doing.

best

Lawrence

Patricio I tried to reply to your post but it got picked up by the spam bot. If it does not show up, write to me you can get my email from my website. Best Lawrence

was trying to find a work around the bot!

was trying to find a work around the bot!

Lawrence, thanks for taking the time to answer.
Some of the issues you raise apply, some not, or at least I think so.

From down here, I don't think Demotix (nor any other European agency that I've worked for yet) is an option for Latin American photographers. OTOH, I'm working quite well with a Brazilian agency. News from Argentina get some coverage in Brazil, while in Europe, right now and taking into account that you have your own crisis to worry about and are neighours with the Arab world, Argentina is non-existant. So at this point you're right, and that's why I say Demotix isn't working for me rather than saying Demotix isn't working at all.

As of the choices, I'm aware of that. Tomorrow I'm doing the coverage of an event at an oil company, it's not just like being in the streets but it's good enough and helps pay the bills. I'm also teaching basic photography.

So, to some extent, you're right in that I'm working my way to earning a good living with photography while trying to do it in the field I like the most.

Still, and I raised those issues because in my experience when you're dealing with good people (which I think the Demotix team are) things happen when you talk, and those things I thing aren't working are likely to be improved.

Of course, if I think I have pictures of something that may be newsworthy that side of the pond, I'll upload it. Right now, it doesn't seem to me like the logical thing to do.

Best from Buenos Aires,
Pat

Hello all,

So many important points were raised here.

@Chris - "My advice is don't give up your day job, and load more images." - Yes and No. Load more variety is my mantra. If it seems the last 40 stories on protests you are shooting are not selling - what do you do? Is it Demotix? Is it the news story itself? Sometimes, and this may sting, we should look at our own approach to shooting. Am I not adapting, am I not moving about? Do I know who is here? Why am I photographing a piece about homelessness when I havn't done an initial shoot on the streets with the homeless, or a shelter?

@Patricio - "News from Argentina get some coverage in Brazil, while in Europe, right now and taking into account that you have your own crisis to worry about" - Yes and No. It is a shame the Western world is not focusing on issues in SA. Yet with your camera you are in a great position to make them sit up and take notice. Features, borders, religious cults, issues, crime, poverty and investigative journalism. Get some super variety. Maybe low level news in Argentina is not getting coverage, and thus demand for your images is low - fine. I wouldn't give up. We have thousands of PJ's who work to get the message out into the world of their problems, sales come second. You will find that PJ's who dig deep and investigate an issue and uncover areas, sell more. The stories become a commodity, rare, and needed. Adapt to the current environment and you may see a bigger return to countries not in demand from US/UK press.

@stephen "Load more variety is my mantra." quite agree, but it could also be somewhat discouraging for a PJ who loads story after story and nothing gets sold - or with no serious returns. It is also praise worthy to say cover the local story, but sometimes the local story is not interesting world wide. And even when it is interesting it might not sell even locally. I mean, I had a very local story (but relevant internationally) sometime back and it wasn't until two weeks later that it appeared in the local press - and when the issue was fixed. One of my early local stories about a potential danger has not been fixed 21/2 years later. Presumably because it did not appear in the local media. Best Lawrence

Please read the post before for this to make sense: And I also had a local story with real international relevance and nothing happened as far as I know. Admittedly, I took the photos with my old mobile (which was miles better than a popular mobile I can mention) but I could have replaced them with digital in no time at all if asked!! Lawrence

@Stephen
Quote:
"Yet with your camera you are in a great position to make them sit up and take notice."

I've been doing that from the beginning of Demotix. I covered everything from protests to the death of a former president to gay pride parade to presidential elections to riots in football. In three years, I've made less than usd50, most of it from the Demotix widget, with a couple of sales that never got paid and some other that paid next to nothing.
In several months working for a brazilian agency, I've made several times that, without having to worry about captioning or writing a story. Moreover, some of them got into AP and Getty due to their partnership deal with those agencies.
As of calling attention to South America, let's face it. A couple of Demotix editors mistaked Buenos Aires as part of Brazil, one even corrected the original captions sent by an argentinian coleague as if he didn't know which country he lives. So, if the Demotix staff has problems knowing where we are, I don't think we stand that much of a chance of them selling any of our stuff. Sorry.
Now, give me one good reason to stick to Demotix. As I said before, if I get a story I think, based on my experience, can be of interest across the pond, I'll upload it. If not, it's too much trouble just to say to aunt Betty "hey, look, I made the frontpage!".

Does this thread and the fact that I'm not uploading any more stuff to Demotix have something to do with a couple of messages not appearing on the forums?

As I've explained in a couple of other places, our spam bot has gone a bit crazy recently! I'll check the moderation queue for any recent posts by you and reinstate them.

OK, I was just wondering! I answered a post about upgrding to FX that I think the original poster would find helpful.

I think I found it and reinstated it - can you see it now?

Patricio I don't understand your last questions? Lawrence

Yes, Tom, it's there now. Thanks.

Well, I left Demotix 18 months ago having some dozend stories within around 600 pictures online, what was at this time the second biggest portfolio from Germany. Now came back to look, what happened in the time and found Your contribution very interesting.

[quote]
As I've commented in this thread: http://www.demotix.com/forum/images-sold-pennies, demotix isn't just working at all for me.
Why?
Some of it has nothing to do with Demotix, but rather with the trend in international media: stories from this part of the world are good as long as nothing happens up there. I mean, now that Europe is facing a huge crisis and the Arab world is at the verge of a revolution, unless some crazy guy goes kill our president, this part of the world has zero relevance.
[/quote]

I wouldn't support that. But of course remains the question, which aspects of a country, it´s economics and the people there are or should be points of interest for the media at other continents. Surely not Your prefered topic, but are there paralells between Argentina and Greece or not and how solved Argentinia the financial crisis? Is there something we can learn from Your country?

At the other hand Your right: not every picture agency can work perfectly for every photographer. Have a look to the points, for which topics Demotix became wellknown and for which pictures media buyers around the world look at Demotix nowadays, because they doesn´t get them via their abonnement contracts with Reuters, AP, dpa and the other great players of the market.
Will Demotix successfull competete with Reuters for example suppliing pictures about an event, which is covered by some dozends of photographers? And if not, what have the photographers and the staff to change, to do so?

[quote]
1. For what I collect, no matter what the mails from Demotix say, sales are a big issue. Other than a couple of lucky people having a cover story, most of the sales I see are either uses by the Demotix widget or something like Global Voices that pays next to nothing. I mean, I'd rather give the pictures for a good cause rather than getting such a silly amount out of them. Right now I have one used and I'll get £1.10 pounds, less than usd2.
[/quote]

Sales are the initial issue, because photojournalism isn´t really a job for a boring weekend, but a fulltime one, the photographer want to stay not only simply alive, but has to pay the rent for the flat and the bills caused by the equipment - for example.

But please don´t think, that such "Penny sales" are a speciality of Demotix. The market for pictures used online ist the fastest growing and the less productive, when it comes to the earnings of photographers. For example Corbis askes for such a usage £5 and if they cut (like the german dpa-picture alliance does) 60% for themselves and Demotix takes 50% from the rest, the photographer gets 20% or exactly £1,00 ... There´s nothing Turi can do, because Demotix isn´t the only one willing to supply these big players and so they haven´t a reason, to discuss about their terms.

[quote]
I carry quite a lot of gear on each photo shoot, come home, upload, caption, keyword. If someone thinks that's worth £1.10, pardon me, he or she's utterly wrong.
[/quote]

Hm, almost here at Germany we have to caption and upload the pictures on location, coming home I can only state, what was sold by my competitors. And the archive sellings are rather few. After the CeBIT last year finished, I sold only one time a picture and earned around 50 EUR for it.

Of course that means, that not only the photographer has to send the pictures as fast as possible, but also the agency has to deliver these pictures in time and not, after the concerned news papers are printed and sold. There are nowadays a lot of stockagencies around, which are willing to get the earnings of the editorial marked, but unwilling to serve the editorial clients just in time.

[quote]
2. Communication sucks. It's mentioned over and over, and there's no useful answer.
[/quote]

One of the greatest point, which maked me to leave myself. At this time Demotix had "regional editors", who obviously quitted after some months and there were forum-discussions initiated, to get the contact to the actual editor for Western Europe. So I used after months the very first occasion, to ask for my account getting deleted.

[quote]
Yes, I keep seeing that resources are best being spent by having people on the phone trying to sell our pictures. Nice. Let's go back then to point #1... A bloody mail can take weeks to be answered.
[/quote]

An argument, which cann´t convince. How can a salesman sell something at such a fast market whithout the information, that he`ll get it? How can it work, if the editorial team doesn`t know beforehand, where we are and what we´re going to provide?

[quote]
Sales notification also sucks. I know, it's a nightmare to keep track and control the use of our images, but guess what, that's why we photographers upload our work to places like Demotix, because they're supposed to earn money out of them, so they'll care about sales.
[/quote]

I dont think, we should blame Demotix for that at the first point. Of course the possibilities of any agency to observe the media completely are limited. And if someone is selling via partners, it may take several months to get advice by them about the sales - even if all concerned companies are located inside the same country. We could blame the Demotix-staff only for not forwarding the recieved informations to us.

[quote]
This use: http://www.dr.dk/Nyheder/Udland/2010/07/15/131215.htm?rss=true was never paid, and it's from over a year now. Sent a mail to Demotix, got an answer saying that they would look up on 12/10/2011, I've yet to have any news on that one.
[/quote]

Well, a picture printed in april last year was finally paid in december after more of a dozend phone calls by one of my agencies. Another picture, which I sold directly and which usage was adviced to me in may by the newspaper itself, remains unpaid up to today. I guess that every photographer here around can report about growing delays. It´s a shame, that photographers are misused as the banks of the newspapers and the loans are taken even without interests.

All the best to You,
Peter

Iam in a country that is facing a big HUGE maybe crisis (Greece). In the same time this crisis had gave me an oportunity to do more and more work even knowing i wont be paid big sums of money. I worked becouse i thought that some new need covwer and spread to the people.
Also it helped me get confidence and morale something badly needed.
The result is that i am third contributor in my country and i plan to get better. I sold my firstfotos after almost 2 years and found that a foto of me was shown on the TIMES website.
My point is never to give up. Keep trying as the feed back and the oportunity to get promotion is a plus. Thnks to Demotix i got work in a small newspaper and got a nice portofolio to show.
So in a way thiw process works as a learning curve for all of us

Im in the same situation as Giorgios (well, I was not published in Times, congrats, mate). I've been months publishing in Demotix with no sales, but suddenly I was at big clash between police and students and I had "the story".

I sold pictures to international press through Demotix, and the popularity of the pictures gave me money for local press, today one of the pictures has been magazine cover and I was interviewed in national TV and the picture was used for their news.

So... ok usually I dont earn money with Demotix, but sometimes... it worth it